As we challenge the stereotype of those who leave religion, we can begin to understand on a deeper level why some choose to leave, why some choose to stay, and how a third option of existing in the moment with doubts and uncertainty is also okay.
As we challenge the stereotype of those who leave religion, we can begin to understand on a deeper level why some choose to leave, why some choose to stay, and how a third option of existing in the moment with doubts and uncertainty is also okay.
David Bashevkin:
So I think after discussing, for these three great interviews with Shulem, Kelsey, and Philo, it’s fair to ask: What’s the takeaway? Why exactly are we listening to such unconventional stories about people who left their religious communities? And each three of these stories are stories about people who left, including Kelsey’s, which is why I think her story is all that more remarkable. But it’s fair to ask, okay, what are the takeaways here? And I think there are three important ideas that emerge from these communal interactions, from the community of people who left.
I think first and foremost, we need to acknowledge that people leave religious communities for a variety of reasons. I remember when I was growing up, I grew up in the ’90s. So when somebody left the community that I grew up in, they went out with – at least as a kid, the way I would look at them, they would get Marilyn Manson posters, and they’d be smoking cigarettes outside of the pizza shop… There was a certain aura of how we describe the people who left, and almost a stereotype of sorts. And we hang on to these stereotypes because they’re comforting, because if people only leave because they’ve been abused, or people only leave because they wanted to party, it makes the people who stay feel better about their decision. And I think that that’s lazy. I think we need to acknowledge the fact that people leave the religious community or whichever one it is, for a variety of reasons, for the same exact reason – and this is really the point of it – is the same reason that people stay for a variety of reasons. There’s no one reason why people choose to affiliate and practice within a religious community, there’s a whole bunch of reasons, and there’s a parallel, and it helps highlight that parallel when we see, there’s a variety of reasons why someone would choose to leave, and by understanding that and appreciating that, I think it gives a better sense of why people stay.
I think the second idea that we’re thinking about is: when someone leaves, it is a point of reflection on the community that people choose to separate from. It doesn’t mean that anybody did something wrong. Sometimes they did, but what can insular communities – and by insular I’m not just talking about the Hasidic community, I’m talking about any community, religious or not. Communities by definition have to be insular. There’s an exclusivity in all communities. Communities differentiate, they have their own personality, and the point isn’t to become this universalist, what I would describe as an avocado community, there’s no taste. Communities need flavor, and there needs to be a point of cohesion that they gather around. But there’s still something that communities can learn from and communities can develop from, and how can the stories of people who leave help the community improve itself and evolve? And I think that that’s an important question, and one that we should not be afraid of asking.
And I think the final idea is in many ways the most important, and it’s the undertone of both the video that we began with and with all the interviews, and that is: I hate the term “off the derech,” because the term “off the derech” indicates – the term “off the derech” gives the sense that there is one very clear path, and then there is being off of that one very clear path. And I simply don’t think religious affiliation actually works like that in the real world. I think people have different periods of their life where they feel more or less affiliated, more or less inspired, more or less closer. And the stories, and the narrative, and the language, of being able to talk about people who left, not as this exit and we never heard from them again, and it was this binary zero and one, but that it adds texture and flavor to our own religious lives, and the periods in our lives where we may be struggling with doubt.
So I think the real takeaway from all of this is that final point, which is that the term “off the derech” paints a very false binary, that there’s something that means being religious, and then there’s something that is not religious. And I think that if you look at anybody’s actual lives and you look at your own religious life, whether you have one or not, you will know that different periods, years, months, days, times of the day, you feel differently. And there are times when doubts feel stronger and they creep in and you think of leaving or you are less interested and less involved. And that doesn’t mean, necessarily, that you’ve left. It might just mean that you’re having an authentic look at what it means to affiliate with a community, with a religion, with an idea, with reverence, with sanctity. Connecting to those things is difficult, very often. Connecting to any community, religious or not, is difficult, and the struggles that we have in navigating that relationship and those connections is not a binary, it’s something that unfolds over the course of someone’s life.
In this episode of the 18Forty Podcast, we speak with Hadas Hershkovitz, whose husband, Yossi, was killed while serving on reserve duty in Gaza in 2023—about the Jewish People’s loss of this beloved spouse, father, high-school principal, and soldier.
Haviv answers 18 questions on Israel.
Elissa Felder and Sonia Hoffman serve on a chevra kadisha and teach us about confronting death.
On this episode of 18Forty, we explore the world of Jewish dating.
We have a deeply moving conversation on the topic of red flags in relationships.
The true enemy in Israel’s current war, Einat Wilf says, is what she calls “Palestinianism.”
In this episode of the 18Forty Podcast, we talk to Judah, Naomi, and Aharon Akiva Dardik—an olim family whose son went to military jail for refusing to follow to IDF orders and has since become a ceasefire activist at Columbia University—about sticking together as a family despite their fundamental differences.
In this episode of the 18Forty Podcast, we talk to Aliza and Ephraim Bulow, a married couple whose religious paths diverged over the course of their shared life.
In this episode of the 18Forty Podcast, we talk to Rabbi Shlomo Brody and Dr. Beth Popp.
In this episode of the 18Forty Podcast, we talk to Yisroel Besser, who authored many rabbinic biographies and brought David Bashevkin to Mishpacha magazine, about sharing Jewish stories.
In this episode of the 18Forty Podcast, we talk to Rabbi Menachem Penner—dean of RIETS at Yeshiva University—and his son Gedalia—a musician, cantor-in-training, and member of the LGBTQ community—about their experience in reconciling their family’s religious tradition with Gedalia’s sexual orientation.
Leading Israeli historian Benny Morris answers 18 questions on Israel, including Gaza, Palestinian-Israeli peace prospects, morality, and so much more.
In this episode of the 18Forty Podcast, we sit down with Rabbi Meir Triebitz – Rosh Yeshiva, PhD, and expert on matters of science and the Torah – to discuss what kind of science we can learn from the Torah.
Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu did not surprise Anshel Pfeffer over the last 17 months of war—and that’s the most disappointing part.
In this episode of the 18Forty Podcast, we sit down for a special podcast with our host, David Bashevkin, to discuss the podcast’s namesake, the year 1840.
In this episode of the 18Forty Podcast, we talk to Rabbi Larry Rothwachs and his daughter Tzipora about the relationship of a father and daughter through distance while battling an eating disorder.
Leading Israel historian Anita Shapira answers 18 questions on Israel, including destroying Hamas, the crisis up North, and Israel’s future.
In this episode of the 18Forty Podcast, we talk to Talia Khan—a Jewish MIT graduate student and Israel activist—and her father, an Afghan Muslim immigrant, about their close father-daughter relationship despite their ideological disagreements.
In this episode of the 18Forty Podcast, we talk to Frieda Vizel—a formerly Satmar Jew who makes educational content about Hasidic life—about her work presenting Hasidic Williamsburg to the outside world, and vice-versa.
Gadi answers 18 questions on Israel, including judicial reform, Gaza’s future, and the Palestinian Authority.
In this episode of the 18Forty Podcast, we talk to Lizzy Savetsky, who went from a career in singing and fashion to being a Jewish activist and influencer, about her work advocating for Israel online.
Wishing Arabs would disappear from Israel, Mikhael Manekin says, is a dangerous fantasy.
Israel should prioritize its Jewish citizens, Yishai Fleisher says, because that’s what a nation-state does.
Tisha B’Av, explains Maimonides, is a reminder that our collective fate rests on our choices.
If Shakespeare’s words could move me, why didn’t Abaye’s?
Perhaps the most fundamental question any religious believer can ask is: “Does God exist?” It’s time we find good answers.
After losing my father to Stage IV pancreatic cancer, I choose to hold onto the memories of his life.
They cover maternal grief, surreal mourning, preserving faith, and more.
We interviewed this leading Israeli historian on the critical questions on Israel today—and he had what to say.
In my journey to embrace my Judaism, I realized that we need the mimetic Jewish tradition, too.
Children cannot truly avoid the consequences of estrangement. Their parents’ shadow will always follow.
I spent months interviewing single, Jewish adults. The way we think about—and treat—singlehood in the Jewish community needs to change. Here’s how.
Not every Jewish educational institution that I was in supported such questions, and in fact, many did not invite questions such as…
Christianity’s focus on the afterlife historically discouraged Jews from discussing it—but Jews very much believe in it.
As someone who worked as both clinician and rabbi, I’ve learned to ask three central questions to find an answer.
My family made aliyah over a decade ago. Navigating our lives as American immigrants in Israel is a day-to-day balance.
What are Jews to say when facing “atheism’s killer argument”?
Half of Jewish law and history stem from Sephardic Jewry. It’s time we properly teach that.
With the hindsight of more than 20 years, Halevi’s path from hawk to dove is easily discernible. But was it at every…
Dr. Judith Herman has spent her career helping those who are going through trauma, and has provided far-reaching insight into the field.
A Hezbollah missile killed Rabbi Dr. Tamir Granot’s son, Amitai Tzvi, on Oct. 15. Here, he pleas for Haredim to enlist into…
Religious Zionism is a spectrum—and I would place my Hardal community on the right of that spectrum.
To talk about the history of Jewish mysticism is in many ways to talk about the history of the mystical community.
Meet a traditional rabbi in an untraditional time, willing to deal with faith in all its beauty—and hardships.
The Lubavitcher Rebbe’s brand of feminism resolved the paradoxes of Western feminism that confounded me since I was young.
Elisha ben Abuyah thought he lost himself forever. Was that true?
In a disenchanted world, we can turn to mysticism to find enchantment, to remember that there is something more under the surface…
18Forty is a new media company that helps users find meaning in their lives through the exploration of Jewish thought and ideas.…
There is circularity that underlies nearly all of rabbinic law. Open up the first page of Talmud and it already assumes that…
Why did this Hasidic Rebbe move from Poland to Israel, only to change his name, leave religion, and disappear to Los Angeles?
Talking about the “Haredi community” is a misnomer, Jonathan Rosenblum says, and simplifies its diversity of thought and perspectives. A Yale-trained lawyer…
This is your address for today’s biggest Jewish questions. Looking for something in specific? Search on our homepage or browse on your own.
